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Note: The Christian Nonprofit CFO Podcast is created for listening, not reading. We provide these transcripts for reference. Transcripts are produced by transcription software and edited lightly. Typographical errors may occur.
Hello, my friends, and welcome to another episode of the Christian Nonprofit CFO podcast. I’m excited to share with you an interview I recently recorded with Roy Peterson. Roy has many years of experience as a CEO and has insights he can share regarding the role and value which a CFO brings to an organization. I was privileged to serve under his leadership at the Seed Company. So it was great to reconnect with him. I know you will enjoy hearing the wisdom he has to share here. Now is the interview with Roy.
David Beroth:
I am pleased today to interview Roy Peterson, who’s an experienced CEO in the nonprofit world. Bible ministry has been a passion of his for over three decades, having served as president and CEO of three different organizations. He’s served in this capacity of Wycliffe Bible Translators, the Seed Company, and most recently at the American Bible Society, where he served from 2014 to 2020. Prior to his roles in Bible translation ministry, he enjoyed a successful career in business management. Roy holds a master’s degree in social science, leadership studies from Azusa Pacific University and a bachelor’s degree in business administration from Roger Williams University. He graduated from Stanford University’s executive program for nonprofit leaders and holds two honorary doctorates from Eastern University and Taylor University. Roy and his wife, Rita, live in Orlando, Florida. They have four children and they love spending time with their six grandchildren. He also provides executive coaching for nonprofit leaders, in assisting them as they serve in their critical roles. I am grateful that I had the opportunity to serve as the CFO at the Seed Company under Roy’s leadership from 2011 to 2014. So Roy, thank you so much for taking your time today to join me here on the Christian Nonprofit CFO podcast.
Roy Peterson:
You’re welcome, David, and thank you for this time to reconnect again. Really enjoyed my years working with you, and it’s great to be on with you.
David Beroth:
Excellent. Well, Roy, you and I have certainly had many conversations over the years as we were in the trenches serving in the world of Bible translation at the Seed Company. And today, what we’re going to focus on is primarily twofold. I think it would be a tremendous blessing to the listeners of this podcast to hear some of your testimony, as you have worked in three major Bible ministry organizations. And I was just thinking how you are literally a mover and a shaker because under your leadership, you led all three organizations in major moves. You moved Wycliffe Bible Translators from California to Orlando, Florida. You moved Seed Company from California to the Dallas, Texas area, and you moved the American Bible Society from New York City to Philadelphia. So you have a lot of wisdom to share with our listeners. So we’re going to hear about your testimony, and then hearing from you, as you share with our listeners lessons that you’ve learned as you’ve worked with a variety of financial leaders— what you have found that has provided you great value in your role as a CEO. So let’s just open up, and I’d love for you to share some of your testimony, what God has done in your life over these three decades of service and Bible ministry.
Roy Peterson:
Yes, thank you, David. The relocations for a Christian ministry, as your listeners know, is a major, major organizational decision, and it has incredible financial and stewardship ramifications. And it’s a great example of in today’s leadership, how desperately we need leadership teams to handle the complexity of a growing, a thriving nonprofit organization today. And a relocation is a great example of the issues facing the organization from losing staff, from a disruption of ministry, the financial implications of selling a property and then finding new property or building new property. When we moved from Southern California to Orlando, the building of that campus was a $40 million project, which in today’s dollars I guess would probably be $50 to $70 million project today, 20 years later. And the undertaking of the financial campaign— I remember we had a professional, consultant look at our database at Wycliffe. And you know, we had thousands of faithful donors who were supplying the monthly needs of 4,000 missionaries on the field. But to raise $40 million, his conclusion was we didn’t have the portfolio to take on such a move. Unfortunately the board had already decided when we were moving, and we had found this wonderful piece of property next to Campus Crusade. Dr. Bright’s generosity made that possible. And, didn’t the Lord meet us? And it was so wonderful to have that testimony that we didn’t have humanly speaking what it took. But that gave the opportunity for the Father to get all the credit when those $40 million came in and that entire property was funded. And so the role of a leadership team, and the role, especially of the CFO— think of the courage and the confidence in God, it took for the CFO of Wycliffe to make a move when the professionals in that industry said, You don’t have what it takes to a $40 million campaign. And so the CEO is leaning on a leadership team that has great faith and is passionate about the ministry and willing to take risks and to go down into the trenches together and say, let’s trust God and make this happen.
And over and over again, I found across nearly three decades that the CFO-CEO relationship was so critical to the decisions we were making and, jumping to the Seed Company, you’ll recall in the early days of the Seed Company, it was small, it was a startup. I was on the founding board, and maybe it was a $500,000 organization, and by the time I became CEO, it was a $2 million organization. Well, it grew to over $40 million a year, and I can remember McKinsey Consultants, who were doing some volunteer work for us said, You can’t do this. You can’t grow 25, 30, 40% a year, year upon year without the wings falling off the plane. This is an incredible undertaking to think that an organization is going to hold together with that kind of growth plan. And it is unusual in the for-profit and non-profit world for an organization to sustain that kind of growth, year after year after year, for more than a decade. But once again, we had incredible ministry growth challenges that were financial in nature, and we had to keep tinkering with our ministry model to make sure we didn’t run out of cash. Even though we were flourishing as an organization, you know, you can have a cash crisis, even when things are going well.
And so it took really astute CFO work to keep that ministry on track financially while it was going through great, great ministry impact growth. And then lastly, I think of at American Bible Society when we moved from New York city to Philadelphia, we presented to the board the opportunity to build the Faith and Liberty Discovery Center, right on Independence Mall. And the organization had never taken on anything— the estimate to build out this Bible experience that would tell the viewer, the visitor, the guests that pour into Philadelphia each year to tell them the history of the Bible, in the Bible’s role in our nation’s history— it was a $60 million estimate and American Bible Society had never taken on a project of that magnitude and scale. And I remember the importance and the confidence of the CFO to go into that business plan of building it out and the cash needs and the costs and the negotiation for the space, and the CFO was vitally involved with me and mapping out that plan and capturing the board’s confidence that they approved that. And by the way, David, it’s opening in less than 60 days. It opens on May 1st of 2021 in Philadelphia, right across from the Liberty Bell.
David Beroth:
Well, Roy, let’s take this in a couple of different segments and have your testimony. So you became initially the CEO of Wycliffe Bible Translators. Could you share with our listeners how you ended up transitioning from your field leadership position in the Wycliffe world to the CEO position? And if you can remember, as you initially took the helm there, what were some of the items, when you look to your CFO, what were some of the items that you initially looked to them for in addition to the move? And I’m sure as your own leadership maturation was occurring, you began to see the different CFOs you were working with in different ways, you relied on them in different ways over the years, of course have different needs of the ministry. Let’s take in the Wycliffe world initially: how did you end up becoming the CEO and what were perhaps some other examples of that initial interaction you had with the CFO at that time?
Roy Peterson:
Oh, with 4,000 staff members, Wycliffe Bible Translators, the board literally surveyed the members all over the world in 90 different countries and asked them for recommendations of people that they saw on the field and leadership that they thought could be a potential candidate for president of Wycliffe Bible Translators back home here in the United States. And so unbeknownst to me, some of my colleagues in central America—we had moved after a number of years in South America, we had moved to central America and we were based now in Guatemala city—and some colleagues submitted my name to the board as a candidate. And I thought, well, that’s a good responsible thing for me to to agree to be part of a process. They certainly won’t choose me. Nobody knows me back in the US. I was a young member of Wycliffe, and there were 30 to 40 different names submitted from all over the world, people with a better pedigree and people with more linguistic experience and translation experience. And so I thought, well, I’ll just be a good citizen. I’ll participate in the process. I’m sure I’ll learn some things from it, and we’ll be able to keep serving here in central America, happily along the way, in which we were thriving. We loved our assignment and the kids were flourishing in school. And Rita had a great assignment with her giftings there in Guatemala.
Roy Peterson:
And through that process, the board quickly narrowed down that list down to 10 and down to three. And we were stunned to find out that we were in the final three candidates and they were flying us up to Dallas to meet with us. Personally, all three candidates were being flown in with their spouses to be interviewed in Dallas, Texas. And I remember Rita bought a suitcase in Dallas to fill it up with things that we couldn’t buy in Guatemala, because we were sure one of the other two more highly qualified candidates would be chosen. And so we’re going to stock up and use this great trip to Dallas to get some fun things, to bring back to the field. And little did we know that night we’d be called into the boardroom to say, after a time, a prayer of pouring out their hearts to the Lord. And they were literally on their knees at the board table, the entire board on their knees, praying. They said the Holy Spirit revealed to them that they were supposed to choose me, the most unknown, the least likely candidate to be the next president of Wycliffe Bible Translators. I had never been the CEO and I had no aspiration, which of course is part of my story, no aspiration to be a CEO. I just wanted to serve the Bible as people, Rita and I. Our passion was to help get God’s Word to every people group that didn’t have it. We couldn’t imagine living our lives without God’s Word. And so that’s all we wanted to do is, how can we serve and make a difference? And so in the paradox, providence of God, he gives us a place to serve, a platform to serve that we would have never dreamed.
And you can imagine, David, as as a young, new CEO, how much I leaned upon my experienced CFO that was there in the office waiting as I arrived from central America and had a COO who had great administrative skills and another young lady who was experienced in fundraising and helping in that domain. And so each one of those people became a part— and because I studied leadership and had master’s degree level, I had already a predetermined concept that I was going to lead as a team. And this would be a team approach to leading Wycliffe US. And so I immediately began to lean on the CFO to understand the financial condition of the organization and to drill down into the reporting that he was doing to serve us and in the statutory responsibilities that were all new to me at a government level. I was so new and so impressed with what was needed to serve the auditor’s each year. Remember, this is a hundred million dollar organization and 4,000 staff and churches and believers who are trusting Wycliffe Bible Translators to be run with with excellence and integrity and to maintain the brand that had been around for decades.
And so, some of those basic basic building blocks of the CFO role were really precious to me. I remember getting that first auditor’s report with almost nothing to work on. It was a clean report with very few things to do. And I remember holding it and praising God, thinking, What an accomplishment, and it wasn’t my accomplishment. It was the CFO and the whole finance department that had done this so well. And so that gives you a framework from my—probably a long answer—into my journey into Wycliffe.
David Beroth:
No, that’s quite fascinating. I think it’s good for financial leaders who perhaps don’t always hear those words of appreciation to hear from one who has been there, who knows what it’s like in the trenches know the deep appreciation that a CEO has when financial matters are being handled with integrity, with excellence, because it really lightens the load for the CEO to know that the financial matters will be handled carefully and that the CEO can go focus on other visionary elements on donor development, on programmatic activities, knowing that the CFO has their back, that they’ll take care of those things. I know you know, Roy, over the years, we’ve talked about the great wisdom and experience that Dave Cram has had, as well as CFO Bob Lips and others, just folks who do an excellent job. So I think that’s a good encouragement for our listeners just to hear straight from you as one who started a CEO journey and the reliance you had upon them and the value that the CFO can bring to the table, sometimes whether it’s expressed or not. The value that is brought to know the CEO in the organization will be well-served in that executive team format. It’s really good to hear from you.
Roy Peterson:
Well, when we walk into the kitchen in the morning, David, and we flip on the light and we turn the water faucet on and we don’t think too much with a lot of appreciation that the light worked, and the water came out the faucet. And unfortunately there, there are some CEOs out there who get the financial report, they get to the auditor’s report and they don’t think about it’s like water, you know, it’s like electricity, it’s just, they have a good CFO and it gets done every year and they can start to take it for granted. And there could be CFOs, you know, listening tonight that they don’t have a CEO that really expresses appreciation for the importance of that role, the blocking and tackling that happens in the finance area. it will take a ministry down if it’s not done with excellence in today’s world. And so if there’s a CFO out there that’s not getting appreciation— I’m grateful that you pointed that out. That well, first of all, we know God appreciates that and that’s who we are really serving. The scripture says, you know, we don’t serve man. We serve our Father, and he doesn’t miss anything and he doesn’t forget anything. He remembers everything we do for him.
David Beroth:
Excellent. So let’s transition to the Seed Company where the Lord in his ways of guiding and directing your steps, you lead with excellence as CEO at Wycliffe Bible Translators, you then transitioned to the Seed Company. Many folks might not be as familiar with Seed Company as they are with the Bible Translators, but really an important ministry that works in the Bible translation world, really works in lock, stock, and barrel with the Bible Translators. But do you mind just in a summary sharing how the Lord transitioned you to the Seed Company? And once again, you’re certainly maturing and growing in your CEO capacity, but what were some of the elements at Seed Company that you found to be a value from the CFO?
Roy Peterson:
Well, you’re right. It was connected and still is connected with Wycliffe Bible Translators as a subsidiary of Wycliffe and Wycliffe US. The Wycliffe board started the Seed Company to create a new translation model that would be less dependent on Western Translators and would invest in mother tongue translators to do the lion’s share of the translation work at a faster timetable. It’s in their heart language that they already speak. They already lived there and they don’t need airline tickets and visas. And it’s also being accelerated, and translations were getting done in a fraction of the time in the Seed Company model. And so as the president of Wycliffe, I was on the founding board of the Seed Company and watched the founder of the Seed Company— Bernie May was reporting to the Wycliffe board.
And then as we formed the Seed Company board, he began reporting to the Seed Company board. And from that place of leadership he poured himself into this. He believed in it so deeply that our colleagues around the world could do this Bible translation task. And that we in the West had a part in it. There was a continuing role, but we didn’t have to be the translators any longer. And as he was approaching retirement age, he told the board that he was going to step down at 70 years old and his role—remember he did this from his 60 to 70—he invested 10 years in building the Seed Company out. And the Holy Spirit impressed upon me as a board member. I was about to be elected for my third term at Wycliffe Bible Translators. And I was fasting. I was praying asking God for the next leader of the Seed Company. And in a startling answer to my prayer, which I never imagined, David, I never imagined it in a million years, the Holy Spirit showed me that the next CEO of this company was me. And it made no sense because here I was serving as the CEO of Wycliffe, a hundred million dollar organization with this enormous global portfolio. And then going into the Seed Company, which was a young startup with maybe 15 or 20 staff members and a fledgling fundraising going on. It was stunning. And yet it was indeed God’s plan for us. And like you said, we immediately relocated the Seed Company out of very expensive Southern California. And we moved it to Dallas where we could be near a very important Wycliffe linguistic headquarters in South Dallas, Texas. And from that platform, the Seed Company by God’s grace began to flourish. And I’m so happy. You got to be a part of that story. Do you know exactly what I’m talking about? And you were there for some of the years when it was growing so fast and we were being so stretched financially with the opportunities around the world. And I know you’ll help me remember some of those some of those financial struggles. Let’s talk about that for a moment. David,
David Beroth:
I have to share a personal testimony. You probably don’t remember this, but this was monumental in my life. So I started with Seed Company back in 2011. I had been the financial leader for a ministry that had $3 million in revenue. And I was able to come to serve at Seed Company, but the idea was I was going to serve under the leadership of another individual who reported to you. And I was going from $3 million organization. At the time, Seed Company was around $30 million. So I was looking forward to coming, learning, you know, get my feet wet with things before I would really be able to assume the full CFO role. So Roy, I’m sure you don’t remember this, but it was my eighth day there in the office. I was sitting there in the boardroom. Somebody came in and they said, David, Roy would like to speak to you in the president’s office. And I thought to myself, Oh no, did I already messed up in eight days and I’m going to the principal’s office? I’m in trouble. What have I done wrong? And we sat down and you explained that there had been a matter that came up. And you said, David, I would like you to assume immediately basically the CFO role, and we’re going to work with you and you’re going to be stepping into that capacity. And I thought, Oh Lord, what have I gotten myself into? You were very gracious. And it took a season to really get up to speed on things. And I got some good mentoring, some folks able to give good input into my life, but quite a journey. It was an exciting journey, but I appreciate your patience with me as I learned more of the details of the CFO role. And it was a fantastic experience there at Seed Company to see what God was doing, the growth we were having, the lives that were being impacted and the Bible translation efforts that were occurring under the Seed Company umbrella.
Roy Peterson:
Well, one of one of the things that is so important about your story David is, and I think this is emblematic of what really is needed at the nonprofit ministry level, is that every CEO would really like to have a CFO who is also as passionate about the ministry and wants to see the ministry happen as deeply as the CEO does. And that shared spiritual vision for why the organization exists. And I’ve been around enough to see a CFO or two who who were 100% focused on the finances and not on the ministry. And that serves and does provide a function. But I believe the greatest blessing to a CEO is when the CFO is shoulder to shoulder, looking at the outcomes, the impact, the reason the organization exists, and the CFO shares that passion while they care for, with great excellence to finances and with great levels of stewardship and care. And you were that kind of the CFO. So I want to thank you for that.
David Beroth:
Well, thank you, Roy. And I think the point you’re making is such an excellent point, because to serve well as a CFO, finances should not be your primary care and concern, as important as it is. It should be first and foremost the Lord, but then it’s the overall mission, and the accomplishment and mission should be your secondary care and concern. Then finances are simply the tool by which to accomplish the outcomes of that mission. If you get that backwards and frustrates everybody and it doesn’t serve the organization well. So I think what you’ve said is such an excellent point that people need to really hear: have a heart for that mission before we start talking finances.
Roy Peterson:
Yeah. Yeah. And if you just focus on the finances and, you know, a lot of CFOs are risk intolerant. They don’t want to take exceptional levels of risk. It makes their life much more risky. And so to take risks, which you have to do in a growing organization, especially when you’re relocating, you’re building out a new campus and fundraising major fundraising initiatives. And if you’re just focused on the finances, you may actually hinder the ministry’s sense of faith and trust in God. And that’s what you brought to the role was a tremendous faith in God, a passion for the outcomes and a willingness to take risks.
David Beroth:
So, well, I have to say we really appreciated and respected you as a visionary. But you could imagine, or maybe even imagine, because you’re such a visionary, but sometimes in our executive leadership team meetings, you would throw this monumental vision out there. And then sometimes you, I’m sure unintentionally, you’d leave the room for a while. We’re looking at each other, like, how in the world are you going to accomplish that vision? God was faithful in so many ways. I’d be interested for you to share your thoughts on this perspective because you are a visionary, you’ve been a CEO. How do you coach CFOs who might feel the responsibility, that because the CEO is casting this significant vision, if it doesn’t materialize, is the CFO going to be held responsible? If the finances don’t materialize quite with the vision of the CEO is going forward, how do you work with financial leaders on that?
Roy Peterson:
So that’s a wonderful question, and it’s very relevant for CFOs that are working with visionaries. And so well, you know, what the visionary might be missing is some of some of the granular details of what will have to happen for that vision to to actually take place. And the CFO’s gift of analysis and projecting, forecasting, what will need to happen, could be such a gift to the CEO to say, I’m with you. I want to see that happen too. And I’m going to make a map for our organization. I’m gonna make a financial map for our organization. What has to happen in year one, year two, year three in order for us to reach that 10 year goal that you just put out there. And the CEO would be well served by that kind of forecasting, because it’s with that kind of granularity, you can then begin to estimate how many staff members, how many fundraisers we’re going to need, how many people in the field we’re going to need and what kind of office space and capital investment will we need to make.
And so the CFO, rather than throwing cold water on the CEO and saying, that’s ridiculous, says, I’m going to serve you as your colleague to help you make a map. Of course, the CEO probably wouldn’t have that capacity to do that kind of analysis like the CFO would be able to do. And so that would be my encouragement, and that’s predicated though, David, on the CFO having a walk with the Lord for himself or herself. Like you pointed out, a genuine relationship with God. If you’re listening to God too, then you have a level of confidence that God is speaking through the CEO. I would not encourage anybody from blind obedience, just because somebody has a CEO label— in the Old Testament, the prophets were rated based upon their accuracy, and if they weren’t accurate, they were not a prophet. And so, it’d be wonderful to have a CEO who has a track record of setting goals, and then by God’s grace accomplishing them. And you can, as a CFO, can look and say, God does speak through this man or woman. And this leader does accomplish things that seem to be impossible. And so if I was a CFO, I’d be looking for signs, is God in this, has God used leader in this way before, and how could I come alongside he or she and help them help them with their vision?
David Beroth:
Excellent. So before we turn to the American Bible Society, I want to just spend one more minute on a point you just made to see if you have any other any other wisdom to show the financial leaders. You mentioned that element of throwing cold water on a vision or throwing cold water on a plan. So when it comes to a map, a report analysis, attitude, what resonates with a CEO of this information is coming to enable and assist, versus perhaps, even the same type of information, but coming with an attitude or in such a way that it feels like it’s going throw water on the plan, what resonates with your heart as a visionary CEO title?
Roy Peterson:
Yeah, that’s great, David, and isn’t it interesting that so many of the things in life are the intangibles, and it’s an attitude, it’s a feeling that you have, it’s a sense of being in it together or not. Is this person with me or are they actually pulling in the other direction? You know, in one of the relocations, I won’t say which one, there were two or three key leaders that were completely against the relocation that was being proposed. And as a CEO, I felt like I was carrying all this extra weight. These are people who should be shoulder to shoulder with me. The board had voted. It wasn’t my idea. The board had voted and they wanted this relocation. It had all kinds of strategic ministry benefits for doing it. But for their own peculiar reasons, they were resistant and they made it so hard. And one of them was the CFO. So I’ll say that much. And so that became a burden for me as a leader to have to carry the relocation, as it were, and then have leaders that weren’t carrying their weight. And I think that would be the same, whether it was a vision or a relocation or a new ministry platform that’s being launched. And there were people that were passively resistant and not really finding ways. This is one of my favorite questions, David that I learned as a young leader. In what ways can we, and I think if we learn to say that to the people we report, in what ways can we accomplish this dream, this vision? In what ways can we, rather than having all the doubts and some of the obvious things that would make it unlikely to succeed. And everybody knows those and sees those. But coming with this attitude, in what ways can we get this done?
David Beroth:
Excellent. That’s probably one of the key takeaways that our listeners can take from this episode. That question, in what ways can we. And I think if CFOs have that heart and that question on their minds, they would find their leadership opportunities to excel wherever they serve, If they have that desire just to serve alongside the CEO, see the ministry thrive. Well, Roy, I know we could talk for another hour about the Seed Company. Certainly you’re welcome to share any other thoughts there, but maybe we should transition to the American Bible Society. That was another massive change, as I was observing the transition. We certainly missed you at Seed Company, and you stepped away while I was still there. You went to American Bible Society. Massive change to go from New York City to Philadelphia, as you led once again a very historic organization in Bible ministry and impact that had been around for generations. So I’d love to hear more of your testimony then at American Bible Society as well.
Roy Peterson:
So I was at my first board meeting as a brand new president. It was January 2014, and the building American Bible Society had been in New York for 199 years at that point. And the building that ABS had built was so outdated. It was going to take tens and tens and tens of millions of dollars to bring it up to code. And it was the wrong building in the wrong location for that kind of an investment. And the very wise business stewards on the board knew that would not be a good use of the Lord’s money. And so they raised their hand—you know, I’m sitting there at my first meeting—and they all raise their hand unanimously: Yes, it’s time for us to sell that building and move. And David, you know what happened at the Seed Company, you know what happened at Wycliffe. And I thought, here we go again. We’re off to another relocation. And the analysis, the depth of analysis that our team did, David, and the CFO was right in the middle of it. We looked at eight different cities from Denver to Orlando, to Dallas, to Chicago, to DC, Philadelphia, eight great cities. And we did an in-depth analysis of every facet you can imagine. And of course, one of the key facets was financial and the cost of living there, the cost of impact on staff members to live there, the commuting time, the church support in that region, the tax base that would be there… All those facets, we looked at, and it was a research project that the deepest level that I’ve ever been involved in, such good stewardship to make such a careful decision. But it was interesting, David, it really turned out to be the historical and emotional and historical roots of ABS right there in Philadelphia. I came to found out, here I am the president of ABS, the founding president of ABS was born in Philadelphia in 1740. And so here I am in this position, and the gentlemen, he was an attorney, he was the president of the continental Congress of the United States before we were a country. He was a hero in the war serving with George Washington, and he was the founding president of American Bible Society. And the location the Lord led us to, right down by the Independence Hall and the Liberty Bell, the location of the new ABS building is right just blocks from where the founder was born. And that became so motivational. Like we are so connected with this nation’s history. American Bible is one of the oldest nonprofits in the nation. And we have a story to tell about the Bible and its role in American— really, literally part of the fabric of the founding of this country. And so that’s why we’re building the Faith and Liberty Discovery Center, which will be open to families and students and the visitors in Philadelphia on May 1st of this year. And it was an enormous financial decision on the board to take on not only the relocation, moving staff, not only the selling of a building and the building of a new headquarters, but then on top of all and the disruption, we lost dozens and dozens of our staff members because of the relocation. And at the same time, they made a $60 million commitment to build from scratch the Faith and Liberty Discovery Center.
David Beroth:
That’s amazing. Well, I’m looking forward to getting up to the Faith and Liberty Discovery Center when it opens and to see and to celebrate what has been put together there. I think this is this is a significant question that you could provide insight for our listeners. So at this point in time, you would have been a very well seasoned CEO. You bring in a new CFO. I think it would be valuable to hear how that relationship, not breaking any confidentiality, but how that relationship began to formulate with a seasoned CEO and a new CFO. Were there elements or are there ways you could encourage our listeners for those that are in an organization from a CFO perspective, how to encourage that healthy relationship to be able to serve well longterm with our CEO?
Roy Peterson:
Yeah, it’s an important question. And it really it gets at the heart of the responsibility that a CEO carries. And in some cases, the CFO may be struggling with a CEO who does not spend the time with them. And the attitude and the perspective of the CEO towards their CFO is critical at this juncture. And so to me, the chemistry of the relationship, to get to know that person, to get to know their spouse, you have to know about their family and their previous roles that they have had and how they got to this role in the nonprofit world. I think the relationship and the chemistry, so that when you’re tackling a major issue and you’re discussing tough things about finances and budget, you know that’s going to come, and there’s going to be tough, tough times and tough calls every single budget year. There’s incredible battle around around the priorities and where we’re willing to put our resources that are projected for the next year. And so the CEO-CFO relationship is so critical that they have good chemistry and trust with each other. And so that would be my answer to how I prioritized the hiring of bringing on somebody new and wanted them to feel— I wanted them to feel part of the team, but I also wanted them to feel the burden of how much I was counting on them for the important role that they had and that they needed to perform at that level, because I was really counting on them to be an exceptional CFO.
David Beroth:
That’s a good point. Because the feeling of responsibility and burden… That would be important for a CFO, because that role is essential to help the organization thrive long term and to do well. And as you’ve previously pointed out, that financial component is so critical that many other many other elements of the organization can come tumbling down if that financial pillar is not solid and strong. So that CFO has to step up and carry their weight of that responsibility. Well, Roy, we’ve been talking for a while. I could easily go on for another hour, just sharing stories and lessons from you. But maybe we should transition here. You have shared different lessons over the course of this interview so far. But when you think about how you would want to encourage other financial leaders in nonprofit organizations, what would be other lessons you want to impart to them? Or if you could, say, love to sit down over a cup of coffee and share these things with you, what would be any other insights you want to share to help them do well in servicing the organizations?
Roy Peterson:
You know, the Level 5 leadership that’s been written about by Jim Collins, I find, myself going back to that piece about the exceptional triumph of leaders, CFOs, CEOs who serve with a fierce resolve for their work, but they do it with a depth of humility that is different in the marketplace, for somebody who has such an important position. And so I would encourage those listening today to take a look at that Level 5 leadership, that book is two decades old now, and I find it as precious today as the first time I read it. And I would say it from the first time I read it, I thought I wanted to aspire to be that kind of a leader in my nonprofit organization. I don’t want to just be good, I don’t want to be exceptional. I want to be a Level 5 leader with both fierce resolve and with humility before the Lord. And so I guess, I leave that thought with you. And then one other thought comes from Jay Richard Hackman, and it’s a quote I have on my website about the importance of being on teams today, the importance of CEOs to lead a team. And Mr. Hackman said this, The demands on who occupy the top roles of contemporary organizations are rapidly outpacing the capabilities of any single person, no matter how talented they are. And when I read that quote, I said, yes, this is why we have to build a team with complimentary gifts and skills. We have to merge together and think, and work and act like a team, because these organizations are too big, they’re too complex. And they’re too precious. We have to take care of them. We have to steward these great works that we’re involved with so that they go on to do a greater work in the future.
David Beroth:
Excellent, well said, and very well said. And I think when CFOs and CEOs and other top executives can function in that capacity, amazing things can happen in ministries, as you have observed over the years. That type of ministry impact can continue for many years to come when God knits together a team, allows them to function well in their own unique roles to accomplish the greater purpose. So, Roy, as we’re wrapping up this episode today, I would love for you to share a little bit more with our listeners about what you’re currently doing. You are providing an executive coaching for nonprofit leaders. You have a website at www.petersonexecutivecoaching.com. I’ll put that link in the show notes here. Would you mind just sharing with our listeners if they would like to engage more interaction with you and lean more of your insights about effective coaching and executive wisdom? What services are you providing at this time to these folks?
Roy Peterson:
Yeah. Thank you, David. So after three decades of experience, this is the chapter of my life where I’d like to give back to younger up and coming leaders who are facing 21st century incredible challenges with digital transitions and other mega shifts that are happening in the nonprofit market space. And so I think it’s a proactive thing, I think a brand new CEO or a brand new senior vice president could build it into their budget right at the very beginning to say, you know, I want to journey in this responsibility with an executive coach to process things, a safe place to process things that I’m going through as as a new leader, as a young leader, and rather than waiting until there’s trouble, do it proactively ask your board or ask some financial partners to resource an executive coach to walk with you once a month, or once every two weeks to have a session to go over the things that you’re that are keeping you up at night, that you’re struggling with, or that you’d like to have an associate. So I’m especially interested in working with visionaries. I want to work with people who are passionate about their ministry and what they are accomplishing. I want to work with people who have courage and confidence and vision, and they want someone to walk with them through, it could be, you know, it could be a six month assignment, could be a 12 month assignment. And it’d be a joy to be contacted by of your listeners who would like to talk about what that would look like.
David Beroth:
Excellent. And I will have to say you have led out in this area with your example. Because when I started in my CFO role there at the Seed Company, you engaged an individual that you knew and put me in connection with him. And we spent about six months in a mentorship role that really helped set me up, well, in long-term success as a CFO. So you have definitely walked the walk and talked the talk. So I would encourage listeners, to those who would like to engage Roy, check out his website and glean from him on his three decades of leadership experience, that he can very much help you in your own leadership role. So Roy, in conclusion then, do you have any other thoughts or observations you want to share with our listeners and wrap things up today?
Roy Peterson:
I’d like to congratulate your listeners for making the choice to listen to a podcast like this, because they’re investing in themselves by listening to your recording. They’re taking time to get great input from a great CFO. And they made a wise choice. And that to me is an indication that they are investing in their future. They are good stewards, and they’re going to be better for it. So congratulations to all your listeners.
David Beroth:
Well, thank you so much, Roy. And thanks to each of you listeners for joining us today for this episode of the Christian Nonprofit CFO podcast. We have considered together insights from a CEO, a seasoned CEO, of the value which a CFO brings to the organization and how you can truly thrive in your ministry. I look forward to connecting with you all again, once again, in the months to come, how we can enhance our insight in order to expand our impact. I will now close in the words of Jude, where he wrote, “Now to Him who is able to keep you from stumbling, and to present you faultless before the presence of His glory with exceeding joy, to God our Savior, Who alone is wise, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and forever. Amen.”